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D-Day Omaha

 
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fullmetaljacket
E5


Joined: 19 Mar 2005
Posts: 366
Location: Warsaw, Indiana

PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2012 2:17 pm    Post subject: D-Day Omaha Reply with quote

Hello all

Curious I know this was covered a while back but cant find the post, some one was talking about making a micro scale Omaha beach head. Was it ever completed? Been thinking about taking on this endevour, but not sure which way to try and make it. One Hex maker more portable but in some ways more work, or mamking a terrian board more sturdy but less portable?

Other thoughts good reference material, ie.. defensive positions, terrian, etc.etc..Also I believe i read some where that Omaha Beach was like a 1,000 yards long. So, equating that out to 1/285 woulb be to small or to big? Also maybe doing the small village of St. Lo or some of the deeper positions inland?

Any thoughts or ideas?

fullmetaljacket
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Donald M. Scheef
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Joined: 24 Jun 2006
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2012 4:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In 1/285 scale, modelling all of Omaha Beach is going to be a major undertaking. Omaha beach was about 5 miles (8 km) wide. St. Lo was about 20 miles (30 km) inland from the beach. In scale, the terrain would be over 90 ft (28 m) wide and 370 ft (112 m) deep. What we need here is a football stadium.

The Micronaut 1/2400 scale would reduce this to 11 ft (3.3 m) wide and 44 ft (12.5 m) deep. This is OK for the ships, but even the largest tanks are hardly distinguishable and it would still take something like a ballroom to contain it.

All of this gives the proper feeling of awe about the effort put into the actual invasion.

Don S.
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Mk 1
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Joined: 23 Dec 2004
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Location: Silicon Valley, CA

PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2012 4:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Most micro-armor rule sets don't use a true groundscale (1/285 or 1/300). More often the groundscale is 1/2000 (about 1 inch = 50 yards), or 1/1000 (1 inch = 25 yards). 1-to-platoon scale games often go down to a 1/4000 ground scale (1 inch = 100 yards).

That would reduce the size of the gameboard. But still, you are talking about taking over a school gymnasium or a hotel ballroom to set up the whole thing.

Better to find a slice, I think.

But it is an interesting possibility.
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RedLeif
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Joined: 20 May 2011
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Location: Boise, ID

PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2012 6:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

At 100m/1inch (platoon scale of MATG) the 'beach' would fit comfortably across an 8' table. You'd have to decide how deep you really want to go but 30Km is only 25'. I think the Fredricksburg convention center has that much room Wink

It seems most of the participants here are pretty dedicated to 1:1 or 1: squad scale gaming, but if you want to do a big throw down like this, scale and faster playing rules are your friend. IF modeling's your thing 1:1 is very cool but you'll need more space.

Red Leif
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Oriax



Joined: 03 Mar 2012
Posts: 40
Location: Sweden, Eksj

PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2012 12:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like the "slice" ida. I think that just a normal gameboard could cover most terrain type, and perhaps a nearby town as well. I happen to have an unfinished piece of a coastal gameboard section... Challenge accepted! Twisted Evil
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fullmetaljacket
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Joined: 19 Mar 2005
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Location: Warsaw, Indiana

PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2012 10:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes after some calculations and thoughts this would be AWESOME, but logistics wise almost impossible. I have the room in my garage to sit it up, but that is where it would stay.

So, with that said what do you all think would be a more managable, and portable option for this area of Normandy. i even thought of doing just the beach head, then maybe a second table for St. Lo.

Or thought two was beach head and then second board where the para takes out the 105 battiery inland. Haveing them set up in two locations and two obljectives. Ie.. the germans can call artillery down on beach as long as the guns are operative, and of course the Para is to take the guns out as quickly as possible. Thought came to me from watching and reading Band of Brothers. In beyond Band of brothers they talk about the battery that Winters and easy company took out, little did they know that on the beach that day was a future senator. Little stories like that always intriges me.

fullmetaljacket
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Brigade Commander
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Joined: 20 Mar 2011
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2012 8:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's a lot of work but I have heard of others following your second idea: two linked games. I never got to play one but the possibilities are just short of endless. Same players playing both games at the same time or two separate teams of players playing at the same time would seem to be just way too much fun! Never having been a game master (judge?, referee?) I'm not sure if it wouldn't be overwhelming though. Although with experienced players, especially who know each other, it would make it much easier.

** My $0.02. If you feel you have been overcharged feel free to skip payment! **
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Mk 1
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2012 10:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Brigade Commander wrote:
It's a lot of work but I have heard of others following your second idea: two linked games. I never got to play one but the possibilities are just short of endless.

I too have been thinking of linked games recently. But in my case I have been thinking of linking dissimilar games.

I really like my micro armor scale aircraft. I like to collect and paint them. All of the armies I've built for my active forces box have at least some aircraft. But most micro scale wargame rules treat aircraft as an afterthought to the ground fighting. That's reasonable, because there's enough complexity in most games anyway.

So .. how to get all the richness of gaming air combat into my wargames? I'm thinking to do an air-combat game and link it to a ground-combat game. Should be easy enough. Have an air-combat game with a flight of bombers or ground-attack aircraft, with escorts, fighting their way through intercepting fighters. However many of your Stukas/Shturmovics/A-20s/whatever make through your air game are then available for your ground game.

Seems simple enough.

A similar approach could be used for linking a sea-combat game with a land-combat or air-combat game.

If I ever get back to GMing at a con, I think I will try this approach. Whadya think?
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piersyf
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Joined: 04 Oct 2008
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2012 11:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've played linked games many years ago, including D Day. Not Omaha, the other end... Sword, Gold, and the paras at Pegasus Bridge. I still have stacks of LCA's, LCM3's and the like as well as Horsa and hamilcar gliders. We had the bridge as a separate table (entirely separate game) with the victory conditions being that if the Germans retook the bridge then panzers would start arriving at the beach head several turns later.

As to Mk1's comment, for the past few years I have been collecting data and working on a set of game mechanics and calculation algorithms to allow the same set of rules to be used for air, land or sea battles any time within the 20th century, independent of scale. I did this so that amphibious operations would make more sense, enabling not only naval gunfire support, but calculable return fire from ground forces against the ships as well.
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fullmetaljacket
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Location: Warsaw, Indiana

PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2012 10:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MK1

thought of a great ground and air combat all in the same battle. Kursk read where there was many dogfights over the battlefield, maybe if one or two Stuka or Sturmo's get thru the screen they can then attack ground contacts Smile I have thought of doing this scenario also could be a cool linked scenario.

Fullmetaljacke

P.S. too bad we all live thousand of miles apart from one another we could be a killer gming group. Smile
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Mk 1
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Joined: 23 Dec 2004
Posts: 2159
Location: Silicon Valley, CA

PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2012 3:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

fullmetaljacket wrote:
thought of a great ground and air combat all in the same battle. Kursk ...


Yep, Kursk plays high in my thinking on this subject. I have more ground-attack aircraft for my Soviets than any of my other armies (well, it IS my biggest army, after all!). 2 kinds of Shturmovici, Pe-2s, even some heavy bombers (DB-3 and Pe-8!), with Yaks, Lavotchkins and P-39s as escorts. But I usually don't get more than 2 or 4 of any one type of aircraft, because they so seldom make it into my wargames anyways that it seems a waste to get more than a few for the "collection" and "decoration" effects.

But I've played some CY6 ("Check Your Six!" ruleset) games at cons in recent years. I enjoy it a lot, and the games seem simple enough (compared to micro armor!) to give a fun game with 6 or 8 planes per player. So ... I'm getting more planes these days.

I'm imagining a game con where I have two tables going (maybe someone else is GMing one of the games?). On one table there is a constantly renewed CY6 game underway. Each round one side (chose by dice?) brings on 6-8 bombers with 4 fighters as escorts. The other side brings on 6-8 fighters. Shoot it out, and carry any bombers that make it off the edge of the board to the other table, to conduct your attack on the next turn.

In the meantime start another waive of air-combat on the first table.

It would be an interesting way to bring more richness to the use of naval aviation in micro-naught games too.

Quote:

P.S. too bad we all live thousand of miles apart from one another we could be a killer gming group. Smile


Ain't it so?!? Laughing
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Brigade Commander
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2012 7:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Long my lament as well Full Metal Jacket and MK1!
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