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Destroyed Vehicles

 
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BurtWolf
E5


Joined: 03 Feb 2013
Posts: 486
Location: Rochester, NY

PostPosted: Sat Sep 02, 2017 1:41 pm    Post subject: Destroyed Vehicles Reply with quote

What do you use for destroyed vehicle markers? I like seeing a destroyed vehicle on the board, it is interesting to see where the casualties were. I have a box full of old sculpts from GHQ and the other guy, items I have replaced with new packets of better GHQ sculpts, and I figured on using them as destroyed vehicles.

If you have used a similar concept, I would like to hear about any painting or basing tips. At one point I made a mold to make resin version of a destroyed tank, and they came out OK but not great. So I figured a good use for the old micro armor I am not using is to paint it well and make it look destroyed.
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Extra Crispy
E5


Joined: 28 Jul 2006
Posts: 769
Location: Evanston, IL

PostPosted: Sat Sep 02, 2017 2:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have flame and smoke markers of various types. I leave the intact vehicle where it was killed and cover it with fire.
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BurtWolf
E5


Joined: 03 Feb 2013
Posts: 486
Location: Rochester, NY

PostPosted: Sat Sep 02, 2017 2:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like the flame and smoke markers I've seen on the forum. Been tempted to go that route but I also wanted to find a use for my "useless" old micro armor...
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chrisswim
E5


Joined: 15 Dec 2004
Posts: 2818
Location: Jacksonville, FL

PostPosted: Sat Sep 02, 2017 11:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good idea. Although I use pillow filler, dyed black. Over time some black, some white, some white and black mixed.
.. One of my first games at a convention, we Americans were attacking, came across T-62, it would have been able to fire upon us first.... GM asked my response so I fired 'knocking it out'. It had a large Blume of smoke. The Russians were told of smoke they saw, thus an indication of our advance. Defensive hidden vehicles were not placed on table until seen.
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Mk 1
E5


Joined: 23 Dec 2004
Posts: 2278
Location: Silicon Valley, CA

PostPosted: Tue Sep 05, 2017 1:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

For vehicles knocked-out during combat I use flame markers.

My material of preference is yarn. Cheap, synthetic yarn. You can go down to your local crafts shop and get some for about $1.39 that should give you enough for 30,000 burning vehicles at this scale. But get two. I know, big spending and all, but you want at least orange and black. You might even get 3 if you have a rich uncle. Then you can have orange and yellow and black.

Snip the orange (and yellow, if you get some) into about 1/4 to 1/2 inch long pieces. Precise length is not important. Just try to get the black snipped into somewhat longer pieces.

Then unravel them. Then take an unraveled piece of orange (or an orange and a yellow), and roll it around between your fingers with an unraveled piece of black. You now have a burn marker. Put a little white glue on it if you want, to make it stiff and preserve it's perfect combination.

What you get looks like wisps of shining flame (remember CHEAP synthetic yarn - polyester is reflective) reaching up to the sky, topped with wreaths of black oily smoke. It's so easy to do, and each one looks different, and you'll feel a real sense of accomplishment when you hook one over the barrel and pull the smoke stream up into the sky to mark the Panther you just knocked out!

I also make pure black smoke versions (no flame), so that I can distinguish between damaged and destroyed tanks. In the rules I play you want to distinguish between mobility kills (smoke hooked under the hull side or rear), firepower kills (smoke hooked over the gun barrel), and knocked out (flame and smoke). There is no distinction in the rules I use between a tank that is knocked-out and one that is brewed up.

But I also have some battlefield wrecks, made from various left-over models and model-parts, that I sometimes scatter about. Much like damaged/destroyed buildings, if the terrain has been fought over before I think it should have some wrecks scattered about. I suppose that these wrecks could also be used in scenario-specific rules to hide live defenders, but I've not tried that yet. My wrecks are mostly for "mood".

The majority of my wrecks have come from two sources. First are models by 2nd tier vendors that just didn't meet my standards of appearance. I'm pretty flexible on that issue, and will mix models more than a lot of other folks. But still there are some things I've gotten over the years, mostly bought site-unseen through the mail, that, well, I kind of said "I don't think so". But chop it up a bit, bend the barrel at an odd angle, put some scattered bits on the engine deck or by the sides, smear it with smoke, and yeah it makes a nice enough decoration for my table.

Second are burned models. When I was younger my friends and I tried making a few short films. Yes, actual films. Before the days of video cameras in every pocket, and share-ware video editing tools. We did stop-action battles with GHQ micro armor, we used cut-and-paste (with blade and glue!) to edit, and needle-heads to score the film for tracer fire. And when a tank got hit, it burned with real live fire (usually achieve with a small bit of model clue, which both clung to the surface and burned for enough time to get some footage). After all these years (decades, now) I still have tanks and trucks that were deformed and scored by the actual flames.

I might add that I think track run out from front or back looks particularly nice on battlefield wrecks. It can easily be produced by folding aluminum foil over a few times, cutting it into thin strips (cut one side only, preserving the edge on the other side to hold the folded layers together), and squeezing a pattern into the strips with teethed pliers. You want to do some damage to the running gear first, including snipping off some portion of the track to open up the location for the run-out. Then paint it up your textured foil strip, glue a portion to the bottom of the track of the damaged tank, running the remainder out behind or in front, and voila! Looks a treat on the table.

Just my $ 0.02 worth. Your mileage may vary.

-Mark
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Difficile est, saturam non scribere.
"It is hard NOT to write satire." - Decimus Iunius Juvenalis, 1st Century AD
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6mmwargaming
E5


Joined: 10 Mar 2007
Posts: 347
Location: New Zealand

PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi

I use clump foilage for burning markers which I think looks great. Here's some I made



And I wrote an article on on how to make them

http://6mm.wargaming.info/page505.shtml
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BurtWolf
E5


Joined: 03 Feb 2013
Posts: 486
Location: Rochester, NY

PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2017 5:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the great responses, and I have checked out smoke markers you guys have made in the past. I think I will try my hand at some here shortly. I'm going to try to post a reasonable size picture of the molds I have been using. Again I'm not really happy with them, and obviously the can only depict one type of destroyed tank. Plus I am trying to learn how to paint for burnt up or flamed vehicles including the rust.





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BurtWolf
E5


Joined: 03 Feb 2013
Posts: 486
Location: Rochester, NY

PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2017 5:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey MK1 please tell me you still have those movies and you can show them to us ha ha!
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Mk 1
E5


Joined: 23 Dec 2004
Posts: 2278
Location: Silicon Valley, CA

PostPosted: Tue Sep 12, 2017 11:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BurtWolf wrote:
Hey MK1 please tell me you still have those movies and you can show them to us ha ha!

Oh don't I wish!

I had a friend who took a creative film making class in high school.

Yes, believe it or not, when you went to high school in Los Angeles in the 1970s there were a were a variety of classes available related to performing arts. I made two films using micro armor at North Hollywood High School. Also did one film with some friends at Hollywood High School, although that one was all with live actors (and one scratch-build dummy who fell from a 5 story high fire escape).

One of my films featuring GHQ micro armor was called "Gronk the Terrible". It featured a great towering monster that was actually an 18-inch tall clay godzilla look-alike with three of my baby-teeth (my blessed mother saved them for me!) in its claymation mouth.

Imagine an 18 inch tall monster marching about stomping on GHQ tanks. We even had some infantry figures running about (this was before GHQ produced infantry, but I had already plugged in to mail-ordering from UK vendors). The problem with the infantry was that when you watched the film you could see our finger prints coming and going in the dirt better than you could see the infantry figures running around. Just looked like the dirt was boiling...

The other movie we made was called "Escape to the Alpine Fortress". This one was tank action all the way. We used a variety of scale models ... from GHQ micro armor for the large panoramic scenes to Tamiya 1/48 and 1/35 scale models for the close-ups, and even some of our friends in army-surplus uniforms for infantry scenes. I can still remember sitting on the hood of one buddy's car, holding the camera while he drove down a dirt road towards another buddy in uniform, who scampered away after burying a mine (actually an old round upside-down Boy Scout canteen) right in our path. Then cut to a scene of a 1/35 scale Panzer model blowing up! It was our idea of high drama!

The last scene was our masterpiece of special effects. A column of GHQ tiger tanks moving down a road to a (scratch-built balsa wood 10 inch long) bridge over a river, with a castle (a very expensive N scale train model castle with rocky hill) in the background. Then scenes of a British "Jabo" with rockets flying in the air (surprisingly easy to do with a 1/72 scale airplane model taped on the end of a broomstick), then the pilot's view as we dive on the bridge with the tanks strung out in a line, and you see the tracers / rockets (we never specified which ... just visible bright scratches) fly down at the lead tank, just at the end of the bridge, and as the streaks close on it, it BURSTS into flames (done with an Estes model rocket ignitor next to the tank, with the wires buried in the sand) and we pull up and fly over. Now we see the tanks starting to back-up or turn around on the bridge. Then we are back in the pilot's seat swooping down again, and this time the tracers/rockets fly towards the tank at the rear of the column, on the other end of the bridge. Quick cut to a close-up of a big ol' Tiger, and a flaming object flies in and WHOOSH the whole thing goes up in flames! (Done with my beautiful 1/35 Tiger model, doused in gasoline, on the end of a wooden plank. Toss a match on it and voila, Tiger flambee!).

Now the tanks are trapped on the bridge. The music starts to swell. Swoop and tracers again and again. Now they are all burning, and even the bridge itself is engulfed in flames. As the camera pans back and starts to lose focus the scaffolding of the bridge falls, and the whole bridge collapses into the river.

For 15/16 year olds with a few hobby items, we done pretty good. Cool Oh how I wish I had a copy of either or both of those films.

But I still have the half-melted GHQ Tigers! Razz
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-Mark 1
Difficile est, saturam non scribere.
"It is hard NOT to write satire." - Decimus Iunius Juvenalis, 1st Century AD
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CBoy3



Joined: 19 Feb 2005
Posts: 77

PostPosted: Thu Sep 14, 2017 11:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I also like the idea of seeing the casualties. I really like the look of the ones that 6mm did, they look like they can just be set on top of a vehicle after it gets taken out.

On the movie front, I would also wish that you had copies of those movies Mk 1- it would be great to see them. Several years ago there were several people on the forum here who made some movies with their micro armour and posted them. That was really fun to see those!
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Guroburov
E5


Joined: 27 Mar 2015
Posts: 277
Location: Coppel, TX

PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2017 8:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I love those markers from 6mm Wargaming. When I can, I'm going to make some of those myself.
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Mk 1
E5


Joined: 23 Dec 2004
Posts: 2278
Location: Silicon Valley, CA

PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 8:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I mentioned in a prior post my approach of using cheap yarn for burning tank markers.

Let's see if I can still squeeze a link out of my photobucket account. While they say that they are no longer providing service to un-paid members, the links I've put into so many threads do not yet appear broken.

Do I dare trying one more posting? I do. Hope it doesn't make all my prior posts go blank.



If the gods of Photobucket do not turn against me, you should see a burning StuG from one of my games (posted waaaaay back in time in the AARs thread). This marker is just two pieces of cheap yarn, black and orange, frayed out and then rolled together. Simple, cheap and very satisfying when seen on the game board.

-Mark
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-Mark 1
Difficile est, saturam non scribere.
"It is hard NOT to write satire." - Decimus Iunius Juvenalis, 1st Century AD
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BurtWolf
E5


Joined: 03 Feb 2013
Posts: 486
Location: Rochester, NY

PostPosted: Tue Oct 10, 2017 5:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cool idea and very simple - I like it.
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BurtWolf
E5


Joined: 03 Feb 2013
Posts: 486
Location: Rochester, NY

PostPosted: Tue Oct 31, 2017 10:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well I'd like what I saw on this thread, and took a swing at it myself. The first couple of prototypes came out well, I think I can refine my method and make them look a little better. I went ahead and purchased pipe cleaners and used a tiger stripe variant to form the base. I swirled it at the bottom and left an upright portion. I've been flocked up right portion with the fall foliage. I spray-painted black, and did a quick dry brush method with some light gray. The longest part was waiting for the glue to dry on the flocking, but beyond that it was very simple. Sorry for the photo quality, I just can't seem to figure out lighting very well. In person the colors are much more vivid in the red and orange is to peek through the black quite a bit.









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